It is in the toli ... PSI & the "paranormal" in the BKWSU

... the stream of human thought that we all have to drink from...

Could you explain what it is, and how do drug takers affect it??

As to what is in the toli.

I met a girl in Madhuban. I think she was staying in a hotel. She had followed her Sister there. Her Sister had joined the BKs and she was really worried about her. This girl told me she was a nutritionist and one of the things she was worried about was the "toli". What I am trying to convey is she was frantically worried about her Sister being in this cult, and one of her big worries was around the food and toli rituals. I seem to remember she mentioned about all the sugar and how the food affected the mind from a chemical point of view.

Reading this thread brought the incident to my mind again. I remember now how desperate she appeared. And I regret to say, I do not think I was much help to her, other than that I listened. It was my last visit to Madhuban and I was in a serious struggle with it all myself by then.

I had come across the concept of preparing food with love before I ever came across the BKs and for me it sounds right. It has to do with finding a sense of sacredness in life. (I found the BKs' take on it, very extreme) Just because we have had a bad experience and a feeling of spiritual betrayal does not mean that that everything of it has to be rejected. After all I have read here how the BKs base their teachings on other, older Hindi traditions, which as with all ancient traditions will contain gems of wisdom.

When the retreat centre was first opened in Oxford, they sent a Sister from London, a really good cook, Brij bhen I think her name was. Very fierce but also funny (anyone remember her?). The food was amazing. But she went back to London. I think the cooks were less and less skilled as time went by, until eventually it was westerners cooking Indian and fusion. A bit of pizza, etc.

And it is not a lot of westerners who can cook like a Hindi Mama. So maybe Rayoflight, you just had a really good cook that first time.

But surely the BKs are not cooking "with love"? What they say is that they are preparing food mentally connected to their spirit guide, transmitting its vibes into the food and offering it to them first. That is a whole lot more than just "love" ... it is a devotion to the spook.

Love for who ... and for what? It's strange how people fixate on the toli. There is some logic to the "sugar rush reward syndrome" theory. It is all part of the infantilisation, is not it?

"Baby wants a sweetie ... well, then baby must be good."

And it is not a lot of westerners who can cook like a Hindi Mama. So maybe Rayoflight, you just had a really good cook that first time.

But you know what, starchild, it wasn't even Indian food.

What they say is that they are preparing food mentally connected to their spirit guide, transmitting its vibes into the food and offering it to them first. That is a whole lot more than just "love" ... it's a devotion to the spook.

Right on. That's what I am saying too. Indian, Chinese, French, Italian, doesn't matter what kind of food it is. If the BK is pukka pukka and loves the spooky spook with all their devotion, it will be transmitted into the food.

I do not think it is "all in our mind"

No, it's also in our bodies. The energy goes into our bodies.

I remember my face started to change. It became rounder and my dad said to my Brother (real) and I once, "you look like Buddhas." My Brother wasn't a BK but he shaves his head so I could see where my dad would see a Buddha in him, but me? (I don't shave my head.)

I wondered if all the meditation was changing my face somehow. Was my body next? I was worried that my belly would start expanding too. I was body conscious alright. I did not know this was part and parcel for learning meditation. Was I on my way to looking like the great Buddha? Or a bald, fat man?

Then I remembered all the toli I was eating. And how sedentary I'd become from sitting in meditation all the time. I thought, "****. There's no guarantee I'll reach enlightenment but no doubt I'll end up looking like the Buddha if I keep going like this."

So at first, during the honeymoon, you shine like a diamond, and then after you marry the bodiless creep, you become fat and round. Sounds like a raw deal to me.

ex-l, your spelling is often as bad as your punctuation, hehehehe. Maybe you're too stoned man ... oh, I like to tease .

Although scientists understand the chemical effects of falling in love, the aftereffects, do they know how and why one falls in love with the object of that love or how to make someone fall in love with you?

Good point, I dunno. I only know psychoanalytic theories like the Oedipeus complex but science ... no.

I do not think it is "all in our mind", or "all part of me". Again, if it was, I would suggest then it should be a constant and predictable effect, we should know how to do it ... reproducibly every time. It is not though. The effect is random. There is some other "logic", element or effect at play. No one can really explain that random effect.

And again, good point. However, sometimes scientific research can have an outcome of random effects. There are always 'gaps' in knowledge. Before DNA was discovered, we had a totally different view of life, evolution, diseases ...

It's not that I try to defend a certain point of view, I just became very careful thinking that the present 'unknown' must be something 'out here'. There were times people thought the God Zeus was creating thunder and lightning. Now we know how this works, so no one believes the Zeus stories anymore. Greek myths are just poetry now. However, Hindu myths are still very much alive.

I am always interested in how we can fall in love, or create and feel a psychic bond, with someone that is distant. How much of that is real and how much projected. I would argue that much of it is real, though not excluding some projection. Is the ability to tell what it real, even of the unseen, where the magic lies.

Science still cannot deal with "the unseen" any more than the ancients could. Life still, largely, escapes it.

Do religious myths only live on, in the uneducated ignorance of, say, India and do "the scientific" and "uneducated " not just invent their own? In essence, moving that quotient of human ignorance from one place in their minds to another.

This girl told me she was a nutritionist and one of the things she was worried about was the "toli".

When we are children our parents tell us not to accept candy from strangers.

I wish they had also told us not to accept toli from religious cults.

Exactly, pedophiles' most used method to lure kids and abuse them!

Wow, I never thought of that. But it's true. The parallels get darker as we dig deeper.