Avakyt Dadiji - Dadi Prakashmani's Death

A month has passed since Dadiji became Avyakt

Brahma Baba can be considered as Avyakt because he has not taken rebirth, but how can Dadiji become Avyakt if she has taken rebirth in the family of a devout/pious Hindu?

Please be reminded that the term "Avyakt" Dadiji was a phrased used by the translator during the Bhog message on the 12th day of Dadiji being in the Subtle Region.

I don't think this term has been used officially. However, it has likely caused confusion since the message is listened to many across the world. If someone has heard the same Bhog transmission in Hindu can confirm if the term "Avaykt" was used or not.

but as pointed out by Arjunbhai ...

how can Dadiji become Avyakt if she has taken rebirth in the family of a devout/pious Hindu?

... this solves the issue, Dadiji cannot be Avaykt.

The noticeable part is that the BKWSU is still remembering Dadiji in her previous form, as given in the many post ceremony events, rather than on her current and future role. However, this is a common theme within the BKWSU to look back and not forward. Thus at times, the studies in Raja Yoga within the BKWSU often seem to stagnate. The mind is pulled towards what has happened in the past, rather than what is given in the Murlis this morning.

It used to be "Baba (Lekhraj Kirpalani) was ...". Now it could turn out to be "Dadi was...". I wonder where "Follow the Father" means anymore. I appreciate therefore the efforts of the PBKs and also the Vishnu Party who are more forward looking in their studies.

A month has passed since Dadiji became Avyakt. She has made our hearts so true. She taught us how to be merged in Baba's love. She has shown us what service of the Yagya is and what great fortune there is in doing service. There is so much income in studying Baba's knowledge. Dadiji has taken on the Avyakt form in order to bring about transformation in all of us. ...

Thanks bansy i can see your reasoning. I tack the above section on here just in case it escapes our attention that it is Dadi Janki herself (in her class) who is contributing to the lore that Dadi PRAKASHMANI has 'become Avyakt'.

Maybe the newer BKs will hear such talk without asking any questions but this is not the case for me. Perhaps the term 'Avyakt' is being diminished just the same as i have heard it said about such-and-such a deceased BK: 'the soul has joined the Advance Party'. I can not help but feel that these are all attempts by the BK hierarchy to elevate their specially chosen mortals. For what purpose? To bring about transformation in us all? Pah! stuff and nonsense.
regards
abek

Yes, I think there is a good deal of mutual backscratching, or fluffing, going on between the Seniors because what one gets, so do the others.

The question is, can Janki K expect the same send off?

The truth is, even in alokik life, nevermind lokik life, people tire quickly and the novelty wears off. Of course they will try but the results will be less. Her death will still be a good excuse for a holiday in Madhuban, some social climbing for a chosen few and milked for the sake of service ... have they not worn out all the platitudes on Prakashmani already? Is the world ready for an "Avyakt Janki"? God forbid.

Oh, but we will probably have Lekhraj Kirpalani's daughter's funeral next anyway enforcing the Kripalani family value in the religion.

I predict even the mass media will soon see the BKs for the self-advertising lot they have always been. I suggest a new motto ... "humble in life, humble in death".

This seems to be a message carefully thought about.

Om Shanti Special Bhog offering for Dadiji on the day of the Satguru 27/09/07
and divine message via Dadi Gulzar

Today, when I arrived in the Subtle Region carrying the love and remembrance of all of you, Baba was standing just ahead smiling and calling me through the drishti of His eyes saying, "Come child, come child, My child who is the image of support for the world and the image of upliftment, come child!" Seeing the smile and the spirituality in Baba's eyes, I came in front of Baba. As soon as I came in front of Baba, Baba said: Child, what have you brought today? I replied: Baba, I have just brought the Bhog together with love and remembrance. As soon as I said that I had brought love and remembrance, many varieties of garlands of love and remembrance began to fall around Baba’s neck. I just continued to watch this scene and Baba was smiling also. I said: Baba, the garlands of love and remembrance have come to you even before I came here. Baba said: The children’s love and remembrance are not an ordinary thing because whenever any child sends Baba love and remembrance from their heart, the rays spread into the atmosphere through their attitude and the whole world receives sakaash. Baba merges that in His heart and this is why the garlands are falling upon Baba’s heart-throne. This scene then ended.

Baba then said: Come child, let's go! I went with Baba to sit on Baba’s gaddi. Baba sat in the pose of Vishnu just as he used to do. I then went and sat with Baba. Baba then said: Child, everyone in Madhuban is staying in double remembrance nowadays. They are of course remembering Baba, but together with remembering Baba, they are also remembering Dadi. I said: Baba, make Dadi emerge. Baba replied: Dadi comes and tours around the Subtle Region many times. She says: Just as I go from one room to another, in the same way, the Subtle Region is also one of my rooms. I said: Baba, at least call Dadi now. Baba just did something and Dadi emerged there. I was on one side of Baba and Dadi sat on the other side. Dadi said: I come and go to the Subtle Region. You say that you will go if Baba calls you, but I come here by myself, this is my home.

Baba then said: The child has now gone to play a part. She hasn't gone because of the karmic accounts or because of the account of karmic relationships, but she has gone in terms of service. So, this birth that is connected with service is very unique. I said: Baba, tell us what that uniqueness is! Baba replied: I will not tell that now; I will tell you when she has taken birth. I will reveal the secret of this birth and the other ordinary births at some time later. I said: Baba, at least give us a signal. Dadi said: Baba, tell her. Baba said: This is a deep secret. I will continue to tell you from time to time.

After saying this, Baba said: Dadi, do you know who came to welcome you in the Subtle Region? Dadi was just smiling. Baba said: Should I show you who came? Baba signalled with His eyes and eight little angels emerged, stood in the form of a semi-circle and holding Dadi by the arm, carried her to the middle. Then Dadi also called out to me and made me stand up. So, Dadi and I were in front of the eight angels and they were giving us drishti. Then Dadi said: Baba, You also come, and Baba came between the two of us. Then, through signals, the angels performed a very beautiful dance. It was as though their language was understood through signals. They performed a dance in this way and then they sat all three of us on the gaddi and disappeared. After that, Baba said to Dadi: Dadi, everyone is remembering you a lot. Dadi said: Their remembrance is reaching me too, but now they have to fulfil my thought.

Baba said: What do you want? Dadi said: Baba, just as You have given me a certificate that from the beginning I have given everyone regard and in return claimed everyone’s blessings, and that I have made this lesson firm in a practical way from the beginning, so too, my desire is that each one gives regard to all – young and old – and claims blessings. That is all, simply give regard to everyone and receive blessings. This has always been my aim. Those in Madhuban have love for me and this is the gift of love that I want. Only when each one from Madhuban gives me this gift of love will I accept that, yes, you remember me. Baba also said: This is the only desire that the child has. After that, Dadi Janki, all the Dadis, Munniben, Ishuben all emerged in the Subtle Region. Baba was sitting on the gaddi and sat me, Dadi Janki and Dadiji with Him on the gaddi. Munniben, Mohiniben and Ishuben were standing behind and some other Dadis (Shantamani Dadi, Manohar Dadi, RatanmohiniDadi and Par Dadi) were in front of Baba. Dadi said: Look, these are my so very lovely friends. This was a very lovely and beautiful scene. Dadi was telling me and Dadi Janki: Do you think that you have now become only two of you from being a Trimurti? I said: No Dadi, we are still a Trimurti.

Dadi said: I love both of you a lot and in the corporeal form, both of you have become instruments to serve in my form. Dadi put her hand on the heads of Dadi Janki and all the Dadis who were sitting in the front and said: You are my companions, the servers in the corporeal form, and I will serve with you through my Avyakt form. Never miss me.

Then, Dadi took these three (Mohiniben, Munniben and Ishuben) in her arms and met all three of them. Baba was very happy to see this. That scene then ended and everyone became merged. After that, I said: Dadi, when you became Avyakt, what was the best experience that you had? Dadi said: My best experience was at the end at the time of leaving my body. I said: Everyone would like to hear that. Dadi said: For a long time I had the desire to attain the karmateet stage. I definitely wanted to experience the karmateet stage. In that final period I was aware internally that ‘I am now going to go’. I was not able to speak but internally I was aware of everything. At that time I was having a wonderful experience of two things: One was the experience of what it means to be a conqueror of attachment. I was not aware of anything or any situation.

For a full half an hour I was in a completely karmateet stage and a conqueror of attachment. While in life, I was experience the stage of liberation-in-life. I saw that I did not have attachment to anyone. There was no attraction to anything in me. At that time I was completely beyond any feeling of the body too. That was a very good experience. I am sharing this experience so that all of you also make the same effort so that you leave your body in such a karmateet stage. Then Dadi said: Baba kept me in the Subtle Region for 12 days, and in that too, I experienced what the stage of being liberated-in-life was. In the Subtle Region I was aware of Madhuban and everything, but while being aware of all of that, I had a very lovely and unique stage of being liberated-in-life. Baba has now sent me in the body, but I am beyond the consciousness of that. Baba will tell you the secret of that later, but my birth is unique.

After that, Dadi also remembered the special Brothers of Madhuban, those who were in connection with Dadi over many years as heads of departments – Dadi remembered all of them. There must have been about 30 to 35 whom Dadi made emerge there. The three senior Brothers were also there. After they all emerged, Dadi said: I would like to say just two words: Remember these two words of mine whenever you begin any service, and then begin the work. Then everyone began to say: Dadi, whatever you say, we will definitely do. Everyone was very enthusiastic. Dadi spoke these two words: Eknami (belong to One) and economy. Begin any task you carry out with these two words. I asked: Dadi, how will you know whether they have done this or not? Dadi replied: I will continue to come to the Subtle Region to Baba and everything becomes emerged in the Subtle Region in a second. You don’t even have to press a button. So, I will see this result and then tell you. Baba was also listening to our conversation as a detached observer and smiling.

Then I said: Baba, it is one complete month since Dadi left. Today, I have brought special Bhog for You and Dadi. I placed the Bhog in front of both of them. Dadi made everyone emerge and said: Now, I will personally feed Bhog to everyone. Dadi then gave a piece to each one in their mouth. She made everyone from Madhuban emerge and said: Open your mouth, open your mouth ... Saying this, she fed everyone Bhog personally and said: give everyone my personal remembrance and give this gift of the two words to everyone from me. With this remembrance, I came back to the corporeal world. Om Shanti.

This seems to be a message carefully thought about.

Om Shanti Special Bhog offering for Dadiji on the day of the Satguru 27/09/07 and divine message via Dadi Gulzar

Dadi then gave a piece to each one in their mouth. She made everyone from Madhuban emerge and said: Open your mouth, open your mouth ... Saying this, she fed everyone Bhog personally and said: give everyone my personal remembrance and give this gift of the two words to everyone from me. With this remembrance, I came back to the corporeal world. Om Shanti.

Are trance messages communal events like ghosts meeting up or more solitary experiences like a dream?

What actually does she mean by made them merge/emerge?

Are trance messages communal events like ghosts meeting up or more solitary experiences like a dream?

As far as I know all trance messages are solitary experiences like dreams. The only difference is that these visions (of trance messages) are caused/enabled by ShivBaba.

What actually does she mean by made them merge/emerge?

I think 'merge/emerge' in these trance visions means 'disappearance/appearance' of the images of the subtle bodies of Brahmin souls who have left their corporeal bodies in the past. It may not be necessary that these Brahmin souls actually come to the Subtle Region at the time when that particular trance message was being visualized by the trance messenger. But it may be possible that the souls that were emerged by Baba in the trance vision may have been in Baba's remembrance at the time of the trance vision (by the trance messenger) in whichever body or part of the world they were present.

For a full half an hour I was in a completely karmateet stage and a conqueror of attachment. While in life, I was experience the stage of liberation-in-life. I saw that I did not have attachment to anyone. There was no attraction to anything in me. At that time I was completely beyond any feeling of the body too. That was a very good experience. I am sharing this experience so that all of you also make the same effort so that you leave your body in such a karmateet stage.

But Baba has never given an aim to the Brahmin souls to leave their bodies. In fact there are several Murlis which say that you would witness heaven through these eyes. Just as children were entertained in the beginning by Mama and Baba, the Brahmin children would be entertained in the end. He has also said that only the fortunate ones and the brave ones would be able to witness the scenes of the end. The original picture of Lakshmi Narayan says that the inheritance of heaven is your Godly birth right. If the inheritance is to be achieved in the next birth, then how can it be birth right? Moreover Baba says our aim is to get transformed from a man to Narayan and from a woman to Lakshmi and not from a man to Prince or Princess.

"You will see practically whatever you have seen through the divine vision. You will go to Vaikunth (heaven) and rule practically, for which you are making efforts." (Revised Sakar Murli dated 22.07.05, page 3 & 4 published by BKs)

"Meera used to dance with Krishna in divine vision. That was path of worship. Here, there is no question of path of worship. You will practically go and rule over Vaikunth, i.e. heaven." (Revised Sakar Murli dated 25.07.05, page 2 published by BKs)

I cannot speak about others, but I would definitely love to be a part of the Confluence-Aged heaven that ShivBaba is establishing. What is the use of leaving the body before we see our aim of self and world transformation being accomplished? After all nobody wants to die in this world. Dying from body consciousness while being alive (jeetey jee marnaa) is a different matter.

"I am soul different from this body – realizing this is as if dying while remaining alive (jeetey jee marnaa). If you die, then the world is dead for you (aap muay mar gayi duniya). You have left all your friends, relatives, etc. First we have to obtain the complete education, become entitled to the post and then depart. It is very easy to remember Father. Although someone may be ill, one should keep telling him/her also - Remember ShivBaba; then your sins will get burnt. For those who are pakka yogis, it is not good to die also, because they remain in Yoga (remembrance) and do spiritual service (roohani seva). If they die, then they would not be able to do service. By doing service they would keep elevating their post and the service of Brothers and Sisters would also take place.” (Revised Sakar Murli dated 17.04.06, pg 2 published by BKs)

Dadi Prakashmani's above-mentioned statement quoted from the trance messaged dated 27.9.07 obviously does not tally with the Shrimat given in the above mentioned Murlis, which proves that her soul has not completely understood The Knowledge and requires to continue her Godly study through subtle/physical body like rest of the Brahmin souls.

Baba then said: Child, everyone in Madhuban is staying in double remembrance nowadays. They are of course remembering Baba, but together with remembering Baba, they are also remembering Dadi.

But it has never been mentioned in any of the Sakar Murlis or Avyakt Vanis to remember Dadi along with Baba. When the Brahmin souls are not allowed to remember even Brahma, then how can we remember Dadiji along with Baba? If we remember a particular Brahmin soul, can we achieve a spiritual stage higher than that soul?

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

Yes, Arjun Bhai, it really feels as if the train has derailed. Whom are BKs supposed to have Yoga with? And where are they going to end up, since our "last thoughts will lead us to our destination?"

Question: has anybody asked some SS or sister in charge what the hell has been going on with this pomp and show, worship of, channelling of Dadi Kumarka's soul?

Is every pukka BK and especially teacher perfectly comfortable with this phase of spiritism and worship of human souls? What are the official answers and reactions, in case someone dares objecting or questioning what's happening or how DK's death has been used and dealt with??

No celebrations or festivals during mourning period. Is this the Hindu custom? If so, why should the Yagya comply with that? Maybe some posters have already written on this, sorry if I missed it. So, all this training on "eating halwa" in case our mother dies, which has resulted in excesses (detachment), especially in obedience-freaks, what was it all for? Or was it aimed to teach us how to "do disservice" with relatives in case our dear ones leave the body?

For a full half an hour I was in a completely karmateet stage and a conqueror of attachment. While in life, I was experience the stage of liberation-in-life. I saw that I did not have attachment to anyone. There was no attraction to anything in me. At that time I was completely beyond any feeling of the body too. That was a very good experience. I am sharing this experience so that all of you also make the same effort so that you leave your body in such a karmateet stage.

I do not read the above as a directive to BKs that they make efforts to leave their body in similar fashion. I see it as being the BKs way of being given an example of how to die in an elevated stage.

Dying alive, to me, seems like forcing yourself until you do not care anymore. And hey, many have reached the point. Good for you!! It means that you are an individual with your own mind and thoughts. Work with that and find your way ... it is so easy ... and does not mean you are not able to love.

But what is it that you do not care about anymore? Family, friends or hobbies ... this cult is doing a good job because do you do not care about anything anymore relating to a life on earth????? Karmateet stage is when you are dead!! Also being pure, only when you are dead!!
Still (you) want to get there and fight all (God-made) nature of body and soul.

BKWSU you are the most bad example i have ever seen of how a spiritual path can be followed. You took a grip of many people all with a good heart. The thing is ... they still are good and you look bad ... ever so bad, and nothing can stop it. Next one to die is Janki ... or Gulzar ... see i don't care. Is that not a good job of detachment??

Good luck!! And do not ever ... ever ... tell me that i am a fool!! I am soooo ... detached from the weather forecast. And still the sun always shines.

Matter is ... they still are good and you look bad ... ever so bad and nothing can stop it. Next one to die is Janki ... or Gulzar ... see I don't care. Is that not a good job of detachment??

I think because they are dying off, they are convinced (or hoping) it's near the end of the drama (again). At least Dadi Janki is trying to create that impression. Yet Dadi Prakashmani has gone and nothing has changed. When Dadi Janki dies, and is reborn again, doubts will come as to their version of events.

I agree with Arjun that this whole thing of trance message experiences seems to be some kind of a vision type of thing and we BKs generally assume that it is mostly given directly by Shiv Baba with minimum influence from the messenger.

We were told that only Brahma Baba is in the Subtle Regions and all the rest have reincarnated. Of course, since it is said in the Murlis that when we will reach our karmateet stage we will not be able to stay in an impure body, I have always doubt that Mama, Didi and the such have really attained perfection. Dadi Prakashmani might have experience the karmateet stage for some time but did she attain perfection?

I have also always wondered what is this thing of Mama and so on appearing in the Subtle Region, meeting with their old friends as if it was yesterday, and giving teachings whilst they are supposed to be in a new body without any contact with the BKs and no awareness of The Knowledge.

When the trance messengers share their experience, they often say that we were all there in the Subtle Region. Well, it never happened that I had any awareness of being there and most of the time I would not even have had any special experience at that time. So what is it, if not simply visions and entertainment?

I have heard many comments about the shift in energy since Dadi became "Avyakt" ... Let me tell you that I live in a main Yagya center and I do not see any significant practical or subtle change around here so far. Although I believe that "it will happen suddenly", I wouldn't bet on Destruction happening anytime soon.

This is not the right thread for me to make this suggestion or ask for others' responses. This is a rough idea and not yet worked out. But I am wondering if "The Subtle Regions" are really only an expansion of Lekhraj Kirpalani's aura. Of course, it could only be the trance mediums imagination but I had an old friend who could read chakras and recounted a reading of a Sufi masters chakras where she was able to enter and travel "up" the chakras into other realms. Her reading were not that dissimilar to "Bhog messages" but generally more interesting.

BKs tend to take this stuff to be unique and remarkable for the lack of any other similar experiences but that is not so. Likewise, within the context of the grind of re-cycled, de-natured Sakar Murlis and a lack of TV, movies, novels and otherwise, Bhog messages remain the single interesting, "fresh food" in the BK diet and are fallen upon with all the natural hunger the soul has for knowledge

... like a dry crust to a concentration camp victim.

Largely, I think they are twaddle to keep the leadership and the masses in their places. What interests me is the training process to become a trance medium. I keep repeating that we heard that new mediums are being trained up ... is this, and how, entire a secret?

Bhog messages really sound like a cheap and ancient form of entertaiment. Of course prior to electricity and the rest how did people spend their evenings and holidays, even now, in tribal societies? Puppet shows and the rest! I read a lot about mediumship in a book I recommended to you in the book session " The Greeks and the Irrational", and I had a smile on my lips throughout the reading.

The eternal mediation between rationalism and occultism, and historical evidence of how, in time of crisis, war and general decadence, in dark ages, of diffused anxiety among the masses, the herd takes refuge in such practises. Bacchian rites and Mysteries ... I used to try and "take benefit" from the live or read from paper trance messages, but at some stage it just made me yawn. Wouldn't appeal to tourists, and discourages Yogi souls and Truth pursuers!!

I am sure there have existed - and still exist - more charismatic and creative oracles on earth, operating from more evocative settings, wearing flashier attire, always a bit inaccurate in their predictions!

BTW, honestly I am not that skeptical after all: I learnt from that book a practise that anybody can implement easily: it seems that placing some laurel leaves under the pillow, induces interesting dreams. I tried last night for the first time and experienced so far not much difference from my usual great dream /realization experience due to the Forum interaction. Well, there's no harm in keeping the bay leaves under my pillow, just in case! We all learnt both the power of determination as well as self-suggestion, the rational and the irrational ...

I do not read the above as a directive to BKs that they make efforts to leave their body in similar fashion. I see it as being the BKs way of being given an example of how to die in an elevated stage.

I agree with above. It is a good achievement for Kumarka Dadi It is good if one leaves the body in karmaateet stage, but leaving body in karmaateet stage is not the goal given to us children by ShivBaba. The goal given is to get transformed from a man to Narayan and to see in practical the heaven established on this Earth.

We were told that only Brahma Baba is in the Subtle Regions and all the rest have reincarnated. Of course, since it is said in the Murlis that when we will reach our karmateet stage we will not be able to stay in an impure body, I have always doubt that Mama, Didi and the such have really attained perfection. Dadi Prakashmani might have experience the karmateet stage for some time but did she attain perfection?

This is what we have been writing on this forum that if these senior BKs have attained karmaateet stage then they should not be taking rebirth through impurity. Whether all those senior BKs who left their bodies attained a karmaateet stage or not is a different matter, but will a yogi soul like to enter a body born through sex-lust?

BKs tend to take this stuff to be unique and remarkable for the lack of any other similar experiences but that is not so. Likewise, within the context of the grind of re-cycled, de-natured Sakar Murlis and a lack of TV, movies, novels and otherwise, Bhog messages remain the single interesting, "fresh food" in the BK diet and are fallen upon with all the natural hunger the soul has for knowledge

This is quite true. Since BKs get Avyakt Vanis only in limited numbers and for a limited part of the year, these Bhog messages are the only 'fresh' sources of knowledge for them. So, they look forward to any or all such Bhog messages, most of which does not appear to be worthwhile. Even as a BK, I was not at all interested in such stuff, but the Dadi incharge of our BK center used to elaborate it like the Bhakti gurus to keep the listeners entertained.

What interests me is the training process to become a trance medium. I keep repeating that we heard that new mediums are being trained up ... is this, and how, entire a secret?

Today, I was listening to one of the latest (numberless) Discussion CD at the local mini-Madhubans, in which one of the PBKs asked Baba about the possiblity of Dadi Gulzar leaving the body in future. Baba replied giving example of ghosts saying that ghosts can enter anyone to complete its karmic account. He meant to say that Brahma's soul (with its subtle body) could continue to narrate Avyakt Vanis through another physical medium even if Dadi Gulzar leaves her body.

Bhog messages really sound like a cheap and ancient form of entertaiment.

"You visit the Subtle Region – you see garden, fruits, etc. Is there any garden there? Baba causes vision. But it does not exist. The intellect says – there cannot be trees etc. in the Subtle Region. It is certainly a vision. The vision would also be caused about here (i.e. this world). All this is a vision. This is called a game of magic. This is not knowledge. ... They say it is by guru's grace; the idol caused vision. There is no benefit in it. Here you are yourself becoming Lakshmi-Narayan, Sita-Ram by hard work ... As regards visions etc. it is just chitchat. One should not wish/hope for that." (Revised Sakar Murli dated 10.09.07, pg 2&3 published by BKs)

With regards,
OGS,
Arjun