BKWSU needs update to 2007

I believe the greatest issues are in my opinion relationships. Concerning myself and some others BKWSU destroyed what we had. For me personally is the detachment issue.

What is detachment? For me it means to disconnect with all that is normal in human life.

Pain is something we experience in our lives. In BK words, that is the Drama. To shut yourself off from pain, you have to detach. OK, so far so good. I learned to live with my pain (detach), it gets a place in my heart and i learned to live with it. Sorrow, pain, disappointment is in all of our lives. It makes you what you are today.

To be detached, i do not allow myself to be hurt in anyway at any situation anymore.
I lock myself out! BKs remember Baba but ... remember a green elephant and the effect is the same. You forget ... or ... don't think of it so much anymore.

Being detached beforehand of things that might happen in your life makes you unaware of everything else. Detachment means to me letting go of everything that might ever hurt.

BK detachment means letting go of everything including hobby's, friends and family. Is it not better to be even more attached, feel pain and learn, get stronger? That makes you a better angel. How can i ever comfort a friend when his or her mother died if i have never felt that pain?

BKWSU has to change, any suggestions?

BKWSU has to change, any suggestions?

A Pakisthani nuclear warhead landing on Mout Abu by mistake might do ... .

One question I would like to ask, and this is probably for a topic elsewhere, is what Jannisder is being told here about detachment true? Has the BKWSU a unified theory of detachment that is taught at all centers equally and the same. My feeling is no. The center-in-charge and students are pretty much left to waffle on about whatever they want, as long as there are "bums on seats", as we say in English. Keeping the numbers of students up ... or at least equal to those that leave.

To me, "detachment" means/meant the ability for the soul to remove itself from body-consciousness. Deatchment from the bodily. A palpable or tangible experience (one that can be felt) no some Neo-Buddhistic or Sanyasi theory of "not feeling" or "not being interested in other people" which is what it seems to have become. For me, the BKWSU seems to have bowed to popular New Agey fashion and is re-interpreting defining itself from the market not the source.

But back to you question? Yes, I think a large part of the leadership is still stuck in the past. The path is simplistic to suppressive, and why should they change? Business is good enough for them? No one dares challenge them.

I think there is tension between them and the revisionist/renaissance (Western) BKs but would I encourage changing it? No. Let it be as it is. Attempted modernization is part of the problems. As I see it, the superficial disguises applied on top of the bare bones facts are causing problem such as yours and Dis. Rather just keep digging in to discover all the facts and expose them widely enough so others will be pre-warned.

In my opinion, even if it was utter crap, there would still be people attracted to it because it gives them a feeling of differentness and superiority over other. A mental framework and so on. And so they would not want to know or question it ... just like Scientologists. I wonder if just like Scientologist, there are people passing themselves off as BKs who really do not know what BK is all about ... ?

BK is really not just about having a nice life, improving one's situation, all the new agey, management leadership stuff they invent. It is a yogi path meant to burn all one's karma. I do not think it is meant to be comfortable ... not should it be. I think they have taken it completely the wrong way, attracted the wrong sort of people .. and hence all the dissonance.

The PBKs would agree in their own language, the BKWSU is run by sanyasis looking for and sustaining their devotees ... not real Yogis. Or as some BKs have said ... Silver Aged souls looking for power and status ... again seeking a kingdom rather than oneness with all. Even if they use that language.

A lot of old hands here are starting not to recognise some of the stuff they come up with ... stuff that would have been completely against the code earlier on.

Interesting thoughts. Detachment. Yes ex-l, on the surface that is what the ex told me. It was to lose one's body-consciousness in order to be soul-conscious. However, as usual, the rules are put forward in very simplistic phrases. You must be celibate in order to blah blah ... no mention of the actual reprecussions for your actions. You must reserve all your love for Baba, if you don't ... blah blah. If you are in a relationship, especially a committed one, or if you infer to another person they are special to you, in order to be celibate one must emotionally detach. This is the reason why my ex says it is impossible to stay under the same roof as myself - it is too difficult for him to be detached. His thoughts stray.

He cant admit to how much he does love me because it is just too painful for him and he must continue on this path no matter what. (His exact words). His path to being soul-conscious. Bloody sick sort of thinking if you ask me. Its easy, they say, just be celibate and don't think naughty thoughts ... these initiates certainly are not told upfront (just hypnotically and psychically reinforced and controlled) on how to achieve this 'soul-consciousness'. Just do this, this and this ... there you are on your way to being a king and riding on a Chariot.

You are so special, you have a special task, you are superior to all others outside of BK dom. You were an Indian in a previous life (yes, I've heard that one too). The people of Atlantis were very clever and genetically engineered the dinosaurs and all the other stories. Needless to say, very embarrassing when something like this slips out of his mouth in company!!!

None of the consequences of 'celibacy', cutting ties with those who actually really care about you, the pink coated dream of detachment and soul-consciousness and the actual mechanics of what is required to do this is ever explained. This is criminal. What also is criminal that these individuals who were BKs, found it too extreme and leave (without really leaving) do not declare what their beliefs are and what their real agenda is before they 'suck in' and deceive yet more innocent people into a relationship (or the hope of a relationship ). In other words, hook someone emotionally and then s*** on them from a great height.

The KISS method (keep it simple stupid) works so effectively for this organisation. Why would they change it? Just look how far reaching it has gotten. It would be like saying you can be a BK and have a healthy, well-adjusted, loving relationship with someone and the act of having children was God sent. It just ain't gonna happen. It cannot. The very basis of BK doctrine does not allow itself to adapt to Western 2007 culture. A few months ago, I was really wishing for the same thing. I did not want someone to not have their beliefs, but I couldn't accept the insanity of what it was doing to family life. The modernisation in my mind of BK doctrine seemed the ideal compromise. Being where I am at now, i was dreaming.

In my opinion, even if it was utter ****, there would still be people attracted to it because it gives them a feeling of differentness and superiority over other. A mental framework and so on. And so they would not want to know or question it

How true. I think that the vast majority of Westerners are searching for answers, for something to heal their pain, for a way to get high and intoxicated, and be able to deny that's what they are doing, and any number of reasons.

Anything to escape and make themselves feel better. And for a small minority a true quest for spirituality. Often people with an extremely low self esteem will jump at this sort of opportunity because it makes them feel like they are finally worth something. (Until the Honeymoon Period is over and they start waking up - then what? BKs wont be there to help).

The PBKs would agree in their own language, the BKWSU is run by sanyasis looking for and sustaining their devotees ... not real Yogis.

Yes, how true. I really don't think a true yogi would evolve or develop from the type of BK honeymoon initiate we are talking about here. What other reason could there possibly be except to reel the devotees in (except for their money of course), that it would be purely delusional to expect these type of people to be able to attain any degree of being a true yogi. Its like saying there can be 108, or 16000, or 900 000 Dali Lamas.

I can honestly say, I have astral travelled. I have danced in the ether. I have soared up through the planes. I have been soul-conscious and ceased body-consciousness for a short time. And I certainly got there without Raja Yoga or the occult practises of the BKs. And I was in a relationship ... wonder what DJ would make of that? I might add I very, very rarely drink and a panadol or antibiotic is the only form of drug I have ever taken. The only time my endorphins kicked in was in childbirth and not in a self-induced hypnotic coma.

I could never aspire to being a Yogi, or building a vessel. My task is in the here and now. What I do for myself in order to be able to give and love others in a less selfish and more unconditional way. I cannot achieve this if I detach. In fact, if I detach and stop caring about others and how my actions impact on them I achieve only the oposite. I think the word "detach" belongs on the shelf with the BKs "not being a religion", or a university or whatever meaning they wish to apply to whatever word suits them at that point in time.

The definition will change according to the agenda. I would suggest that instead of BKs all being Indian in previous lives, it is the other way around. Their command and usage of the English language is extremely impressive. Most Westerners could only dream of having the skills to twist words the way these sanyasis do.

Oh, I thought you all might like this one. I suggested did he really think that I was going to die a most horrendous death etc etc because I was not a BK? The answer, get this, is NO ... because most people that aren't BKs will never know anything about it and never know any different. So I wont neccessarily die in absolute agony and all the other prophesies of what I am going to suffer because I am not a BK. I couldn't make sense of it either ... Just twist again ... reminds me of a song from the fifties, just where all this other c*** belongs, in history ...

By the way, thank you all for letting me rant and rave and letting it all hang out. This forum is definitely the best therapy. Hugs and heart felt love, Di

Wow what an inspiring post. Thank you Di.

I could never aspire to being a Yogi, or building a vessel ... By the way, thank you all for letting me rant and rave and letting it all hang out. This forum is definitely the best therapy. Hugs and heart felt love, Di

Hey Di

You may as well chose the path of a Yogi - all the twists and turns your life is taking qualifies you as top yogi of high stature and ability - take care though because of you insisting on living your truth all your 'students' will really have a tough time under you!

I am happy to know this forum is offering great therapy, makes me glow all pink like! Its therapy for me too ...

Don't worry about your 'ranting and raving' - we understand and send love and huge hugz to you too. Let what must flow, flow!

xx p xx

Hi Paul,

I could never be a Yogi, I love my hugs and kisses and am a very tactile and affectionate person.

I would like to think firm but fair. My staff used to say that. They also said I was one of the few they felt they could come to no matter what and they were always happy for me to teach them ... but I admit, quite pedantic in the 'right' way to do things. So you got me pegged there. But they would say, 'Great, Sister Di's on. We'll have a good shift.' That was always so nice for me. Friends and family say way too soft, that I expected way to much of myself and not enough of anyone else ... Hope I am not sounding like a hard case here on this forum ... I cannot be too bad though, ex says I am really easy to live with, and all 3 teenage boys are still at home and threatening never to leave. (Better be quiet now, everyone will know too much about me!) I am glad I turn you pink and not blue

I could never be a Yogi, I love my hugs and kisses, am a very tactile and affectionate person.

Hey there! I consider myself a yogi but no longer a rajyogi and I love hugs and kisses which is a huge difference between 'then' and now! Maybe we should stand outside BK morning class and accost every BK as they emerge with LUV, big wet kisses and rosy pink hugs, that may just cause some changes of a nice kind ... Have no fear, Di and Paul are near! We could get quite a following going I reckon ...

BK detachment means letting go of everything including hobby's, friends and family. Is it not better to be even more attached, feel pain and learn, get stronger? That makes you a better angel. How can I ever comfort a friend when his or her mother died if I have never felt that pain?

If we understand that the soul leaves a body and takes another, then there is no need for sorrow. What has been an old man is now a baby. It is even a matter of happiness. I feel that if this knowledge is explained and understood well, it makes a lot of difference. Otherwise it is very false and confused and a world that is based on ignorance. There are superstitions, devotion, we do all the time. For example, on the obituary notice or tumbstone it says, "rest in peace", but the soul does not rest in peace when he leaves the body.

Or we say he has gone to heaven or hell. When someone leaves the body in hell, where there is no peace, it is reborn in hell again where we live. Where is there no peace and happiness? Now peace is establised and happiness is established to last for a long time.

It is also funny how people will remember the dead body that is eaten by worms. The body through which the soul cound have experienced suffering, they remember this, go to the grave and shed tears. Why don't they remember the soul that is living and has left, and is somewhere now still living? We should not feel pain now. If we are to become spiritual doctor then the doctor need not pass through all the illnesses so that he can cure them. What if he faints every time he sees blood, out of compassion, would this seem right? We must be strong now.