On the way to Paramdham

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new knowledge

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Re: On way to Paramdham

Post09 May 2008

andrey wrote:there is no communication.

Brother, when you are in Paramdham, how do you conclude that you don't communicate with any soul there? In order to come to such conclusion, you must be aware that other souls are also present there in Paramdham & that in spite of their presence, you don't communicate with them. And, without communiting whth them, how may you be aware of their presence?

new knowledge

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Re: On way to Paramdham

Post09 May 2008

andrey wrote:What you may describe as Paramdham could be the blissful world (if we suppose bliss means jeevanmukti). So this games of deities happens in the Golden Age.

I've already explained that the Golden Age pleasures are also Mayavi, which is a bribe given by Maya, so that our mind should be diverted from the real Godly love & pleasures of Paramdham.

And yes now in the Confluence Age all this happen in an unlimited way. We play with the Supreme Soul. We feel sweet silence when we are in front of him (physically, intellectually).

Had, Behad & Anhad (Limited, Unlimited & Beyond Unlimited):-
BKWSU talks of only Had (limited) & Behad (unlimited), but holy scriptures also talk about Anhad (beyond unlimited). I'll post a separate article how the broad drama is 'Had ka drama' (drama of limited sense of meaning), Confluence Age drama is 'Behad drama' (drama of unlimited sense of meaning) & Paramdham is 'Anhad drama' (drama of beyond unlimited sense of meaning).

    1) In the broad drama, we play negligible role which is comparatively meaningless for our spiritual progress, so the broad drama is 'drama of limited sense of meaning',
    2) The Confluence Age drama is rehearsal/shooting of the blissful drama of Paramdham. Only in the Confluence Age, the Supreme Soul directly incarnates (physically) here on this earth. Due to His presence, the Confluence Age drama becomes the model of Paramdham, i.e, Paramdham-like stage is created here on the earth in the Confluence Age. This drama is very meaningful for our spiritual progress, so the Confluence Age drama is 'drama of unlimited sense of meaning' &
    3) Only in the Paramdham, our original 'self' is practically fully imerged. We have constant connection with the Supreme Soul, so Paramdham is 'drama of beyond unlimited sense of meaning'.
But please, say where is this Paramdham to you? Is it on earth? Where?

It is beyond the material, subtle & casual world. It is beyond the range of mathematical calculations & beyond the scope of theory of Relativity.
And where is the Supreme Soul at present? Is it in some body? Which one?

Now He is with you & me - physically present here - He may be in BKWSU or out of BKWSU. But I don't know that body in which He is playing His role. He has created/will creat Paramdham-like stage here, so that we could have a glimpse of the eternal blissful sports in Paramdham & make ourself ready for the final journey of Paramdham, i.e, the Supreme Heaven.

This is my personal churning based on Murlis & holy scriptures.
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andrey

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Re: On way to Paramdham

Post10 May 2008

In the Murlis Paramdham is not called heaven. Heaven is called the heaven in the Confluence Age and the heaven in the Golden Age.

Do you believe in The Cycle? Because if some will leave in their final journey to Paramdham and they wont return then The Cycle will stop.

new knowledge

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Re: On way to Paramdham

Post10 May 2008

andrey wrote:In the Murlis Paramdham is not called heaven.

Christians call Paramdham as 'the Heaven of the Supreme Truth God' & Muslims call it 'Arsh-E-Azim'.
Heaven is called the heaven in the Confluence Age and the heaven in the Golden Age.

Confluence Age heaven is the rehearsal/shooting of the Paramdham, i.e, the Heaven of the Supreme Truth God, i.e, Arsh-E-Azim. The Golden Age heaven is Mayavi.
Do you believe in The Cycle? Because if some will leave in their final journey to Paramdham and they wont return then The Cycle will stop.

I am not sure whether The Cycle exists or not. But the word 'final journey' may be used only for the time period of the present Kalpa.
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andrey

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Re: On way to Paramdham

Post10 May 2008

We have knowledge for Paramdham by the Supreme Soul. We get to know it by description when we study and learn about how it is described, then based on this we may experience. If the Paramdham of suprem bliss, with movement, play and sport exists somewhere else above the material world, then what will happen to the physical body that is on earth when one goes the supreme abode, according to you? According to the Murli, Christians and Muslims don't go to Golden Age so they call heaven and Jannat for the confluenced aged heaven. If as you say there is shooting fo the supreme abode, then there will also be shooting for the Golden Age. What will this be called? If we accept that supreme abode means that soul lives in supreme stage whilst on earth, then I am ready to accept whatever you say.

new knowledge

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Re: On way to Paramdham

Post11 May 2008

Brother, all your queries have been already discussed many times in this thread. Why to repeat them again & again?

new knowledge

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Re: On the way to Paramdham

Post29 May 2008

new knowledge wrote:BKWSU talks of only Had (limited) & Behad (unlimited), but holy scriptures also talk about Anhad (beyond unlimited.)

Recently I've got a Murli point which also refers Anhad, i.e, beyond Unlimited sense of meaning. Read the Murli point, "Had aur Behad ke bhee paar jaanaa hai. Kahaa jaataa hai naa 'Had, Behad se paar', to buddhi main yah gyaan rahta hai, Had, Behad se paar jaanaa hai. Baap ke liye bhee kahaa jaataa hai 'Had, Behad se paar', iskaa bhee arth samaznaa chaahiye naa." (Murli date: 7-2-78 Page. 1) meaning "We have to go beyond also the Limited & Unlimited. It is said 'Beyond Limited, Unlimited, so it lies in the intellect that we have to go beyond Limited, Unlimited. It is also said for the Father 'Beyond Limited, Unlimited', the meaning of this also should be understood".

In BKWSU, broad drama is referred as 'Had ka drama', i.e, the drama of Limited sense of meaning & the Confluence Age Drama is referred as 'Behad ka drama', i.e, the drama of Unlimited sense of meaning. Then, does not this Murli point indicate that we have to go beyond both Had (broad drama) & Behad (Confluence Age Drama), i.e, we have to go to Anhad, i.e, drama of beyond Unlimited sense of meaning, Paramdham????
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arjun

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Re: On the way to Paramdham

Post30 May 2008

Dear Brother,
You speak of the actual Paramdham (Soul World) situated beyond this Universe as 'anhad' (beyond limited and unlimited), but in a way you are referring to the physical Paramdham. So, is that also not limited? Moreover, how can one experience that physical Paramdham? It can be only after leaving this body. And who will return to relate their experience of that physical Paramdham?
OGS,
Arjun

new knowledge

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Re: On the way to Paramdham

Post30 May 2008

arjun wrote:You speak of the actual Paramdham (Soul World) situated beyond this Universe as 'anhad' (beyond limited & unlimited), but in a way you are referring to the physical Paramdham.

Then what do you mean by 'Anhad'?
So, is that also not limited?

I've already explained that just as complex numbers cannot be expressed in terms of real (positive & negative) numbers, like the same way, everything in Paramdham cannot be measured or expressed in terms of wordly mathematics. In this sense, Paramdham is beyond limited & unlimited; as limited & unlimited come under the realm of worldly mathematics.
Moreover, how can one experience that Paramdham? It can be only after leaving this body.

Can you have 'real life experiences' in dreams? Would you like to be always in dreamlike conditions?
And who will return to relate their experience of that physical Paramdham?

Only in our Home - Paramdham - we live with our original nature. When we leave Paramdham, we forget that Paramdham, blissful sports in Paramdham & our true nature due to the influence of Maya. It's only God who never comes under the influence of Maya & when He incarnates on earth, He relates the experience of Paramdham & also creates Paramdham-like situation (not real Paramdham) here, on this earth, in the form of the Confluence Aged Heaven.
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arjun

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Re: On the way to Paramdham

Post31 May 2008

new knowledge wrote:Then what do you mean by 'Anhad'?

Actually, the meaning of 'anhad' and 'behad' is the same, i.e. unlimited. Both the words are used in the Murli, but the word 'behad' is used more frequently. 'anhad' is a Hindi word whereas 'behad' is a Urdu word.

In the Murlis the word 'anhad' is used to describe the method of remembrance of God in the path of worship by some sects called 'anhad naad' or 'ajapaajaap'. One method of remembrance in the path of worship is through chants (jaap) or sounds (naad) and the other is beyond chants (ajapaajaap) and sounds (anhad naad). Baba also wants us to follow the second method wherein we remain in soul consciousness naturally and continuously and remember the Father without the necessity for chanting His name or without the help of any sounds.

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Journey Beyond Unlimited

Post21 Jul 2008

new knowledge wrote:Read the Murli point, "Had aur Behad ke bhee paar jaana hai ..." (Murli date: 7-2-78 Page. 1) meaning "We have to go also beyond Limited & Unlimited ..."

Arjun Bhai, according to you, the word 'Anhad' is used to describe the method of remembrance of God in worship cults through chants & sounds & the Word 'Behad' is used to describe the method of remembrance of God beyond chants & sounds. And you wish to follow the 'Behad' method to remember God, i.e, you are not ready to go beyond 'Behad'. But all your explanation does not explain the meaning of this Murli point which suggests to go beyond even Behad, i.e, Unlimited. Does not your quotation go against Murli point?

For you, the Confluence Age is Behad. Then does not this Murli point suggest us to go beyond 'Behad', i.e, beyond the Confluence Age Drama? What do you mean by 'Had, Behad ke paar' (beyond Limited & unlimited)?

new knowledge

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Re: On the way to Paramdham

Post22 Jul 2008

Dear PBK Brothers & Sisters,

    * Who is that soul who will be the first to go to the inert Paramdham?
    * Who will go to the inert Paramdham at last?
    * Who will return first from Paramdham?
    * Who will return from Paramdham at last?
    * When will the soul of Ram go to the inert Paramdham? - In 2018 or 2036?
    * When will the Confluence Aged deities give birth to the Golden Aged deities? - Before going to the inert Paramdham or after returning from Paramdham?

new knowledge

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Re: On the way to Paramdham

Post26 Jul 2008

As I was taught in the basic 7-days BK Godly knowledge course, just as this Corporeal World is comprised of 5 elements - earth, water, air, fire & ether; similarly Paramdham is made of the Brahm element - the 6th element of the nature. What's this Brahm element as believed by BKs & PBKs? What are its attributes?

* BKs also believe that some part of this Brahm element of Paramdham temporarily get converted into the Subtle Region during the Confluence Age. Here I am a little bit confused about how temporary conversion of the Brahm element of Paramdham get converted into the Subtle Region?
How could some part of Paramdham, which is 'the Dead Silence World', convert (though temporarily!) into the Subtle Region, which is the Movie World????
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arjun

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Re: On the way to Paramdham

Post26 Jul 2008

new knowledge wrote:* Who will go to the inert Paramdham at last?
* Who will return first from Paramdham?

The soul of the Confluence-Aged Ram (Baba Virendra Dev Dixit, acc. to me and some other PBKs)
* When will the soul of Ram go to the inert Paramdham? - In 2018 or 2036?

I suppose it will be in 2036.
* Who is that soul who will be the first to go to the inert Paramdham?

I don't know the exact answer but I can guess it could be the Brahmin souls with sanskars of Islam religion based on what I heard Baba say in one of the discussion CDs.
* Who will return from Paramdham at last?

Are you speaking about the 9,00,000th soul to come in the first birth? Or the 10 croreth soul (at the end of the Silver Age)? If you are speaking of the latter, I guess it could be the Brahmin souls with the sanskars of atheist religion. But if you are speaking of the former I guess it could be the Brahmin souls with the sanskars of the Arya Samaj religion.
* When will the Confluence Aged deities give birth to the Golden Aged deities? - Before going to the inert Paramdham or after returning from Paramdham?

After returning from the Supreme Abode.
* BKs also believe that some part of this Brahm element of Paramdham temporarily get converted into the Subtle Region during the Confluence Age.

I am hearing this for the first time. Anyone else has heard about it?
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ex-l

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Re: On the way to Paramdham

Post26 Jul 2008

* BKs also believe that some part of this Brahm element of Paramdham temporarily get converted into the Subtle Region during the Confluence Age.
arjun wrote:I am hearing this for the first time. Anyone else has heard about it?

We were not taught that, nor taught to teach that but perhaps it is just a small misunderstanding.

The thought that the Subtle Region magically appears somehow at some point during the Confluence Age (which is what we were taught to teach) is equally loose and fairy story like, e.g. an explanation good enough for children, or those with a child-like intellect. Such 'spirit worlds' are recorded by other religions (e.g. Buddhism, Spiritualism, Shamanism etc) through all times and cultures.

Of course, the BKWSU denies their validity or existence and cannot give a comparative answer about them and their existence. But ... having said that, new knowledge is asking us perfectly fair questions which no one can really answer.
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