ex-l wrote:Krishna's amorality is very well discussed and critiqued by Hindu thinkers, e.g. why he encouraged Arjuna to break the rules to win ... Human create the gods they want. If one's gods are tricky and amoral, then it excuse one's own trickiness and amorality.
I think you need to see it other way too. It seems no different than a BK view. Where has the discretionary forum gone? And such talks again place a particular God in a limited domain like your god, my god, etc. Well, I agree that human like Lekhraj Kirpalani do create God but that does not hold true for basic religions like Hinduism, Christianity, Buddhism, Islam, etc.
You might also say, given that the Biblical God is angry and murderous, it has encouraged the West to be angry and murderous and I would say you see this in action with, say, the largely Biblical society of America today.
And for that neither the Bible nor Jesus is responsible. It is just same as Newton & Einstein gave laws & other used it in both positive & negative ways. For that neither Newton nor Einstein is responsible. You need to see the blunders of propagator, why to blame someone who has got nothing to do with religion or his followers? But if you are an atheist, then I would still say to keep up your views without harming others interest.
I used to think about my presence here. I may be posting according to my experience in BKism, a broken friendship with a close friend due to BKism & many other cases available & adding regularly on this site. But somewhere I always used to have this feeling whether I am doing it right by opposing everything the BKs offer. Definitely spirituality is wrongly presented in BKism but there are other positive aspects too (which we all know, like that temporary initial happiness part) except breaking relations & looting all financial asset of BKs. Many BKs rely on Bkism as lifetime achievement.
May be one of my comments support a sufferer of bkism but it may end up hurting 100s other BKs. Alright, I am not here to make certain image of mine but still there is responsibility of everything we do, or not? My belief is to solve a problem with equanimity, it is of no use to save one by killing hundreds. So, the conclusion is whether one oppose BKism and religions, he must keep, in his mind, that there is no victory through wars, pieces left do not bring peace, and hurting religious sentiments, certainly, is not the solution.
Back on topic, reading the Kama Sutra, looking at the Khajuraho temples, watching Indian dancers and imaging how the Rajas lived with their extreme wealth and harems, I would say India wins hands down on the "pleasure factor".
And this comment may be taken as a huge applause by currently prevailing conditions in India.
You've obviously never been to a cold, wet, Protestant country ... we don't do pleasure at all. We are good at science, engineering and war ... and democracy and human rights ... but we are not able to be sensual because of the cold, dark winters and having to dress up all the time. It has made us driven us more intellectual into the mind I think.
Sorry to say but I have seen that truth cannot be seen with help of limited intellect. Secondly, the contribution to sexuality is mostly from non-Indian segment, everyone know that. And I would prefer to remain on the topic rather than turning into an argument of which country is best, which religion is best ... etc etc. Most importantly, the issue here raised is the exposing Bkism of maligning Hinduism & I think you are doing opposite thing. Correct me if I am wrong.
India - and especially its women - is far, far, far more sensual in every way.
Too much generalization should come only if you know everything or become an omniscient Lord. There is more to India than what you have seen.
... however, the West has moved on and is far more objective and genuinely interesting in other cultures and beliefs.
However, West has accepted much of the Indian culture. All the spiritualism has been brought up & introduced to West by Indian babas, the few good ones. It is said that India exporting its sanskaars, culture & tradition & importing the filth of manners & etiquette. And this is the reason why India is facing too much criticism from West.
As to whether there is a real Krishna, a real enlightened being ... who knows. Unless I meet him, I cannot tell.
Then you should try to abandon both aspects right as well as wrong aspect related to Lord Krishna, why this negativity towards him?
What the BKs say is that no individual has become enlightened, there is no release from The Cycle of time, all such beings have declined in spiritual status, including Krishna, Buddha, Christ, Saints, Saddhus etc and are incarnate as impure and ignorant (in their terms) human beings today .....
And it is what I repeatedly point out, that they have no understanding regarding Hinduism or any other religion. You get that from their failed predictions while I get it from spiritual & religious facts.
As you don't know anything about my life, and apparently little about Western spiritual traditions, I would be careful before making such prejudiced comments about the differences between the West and an India where 600 million people still defecate on the ground in the open air and the most terrible injustices still go on. Injustices the West gave up in 100s of years ago
All right, just cool down. As far as these sanitation problem are concerned, there was a complete science behind defecating in open. The animals' excretion gets converted into natural manure & human's excreta gets decomposed. Now, this science is of less or no use. Present sanitation system & industrialization is rapidly polluting all drinking water resources. Analyze it deeply, then you may find that it is not worth drinking water. But today we cannot follow the old method & so there is a reason why Indian government is keen to get 100% hygiene to add comfort as well as immunity to diseases.