So is "soul consciousness" correct ?

After all the threads here and there, has it been concluded that the concept of "soul consiousness" is a worthy idea ? (to the BKs, the only idea).

Look around you, and especially in recent days, with all the (alleged) trade protectionisms coming out during these tough economic times. With soul consciousness, aren't we really all in one big happy family ?

With soul consciousness, aren't we really all in one big happy family?

The idea of humanity as one is not exactly new but the idea is great. The problem with the BKWSU is that what we get is not just "soul consciousness," but soul consciousness™ with the BKWSU leaders at the helm of world domination.

Do we really believe that the BKWSU's so-called system, which is largely a non-system, would scale up to a global level?

Dadi Janki pronouncing that all the Arabs and Jews need is "more Yoga", Sister Mohini telling the Americans to "Remember Baba" and pass the bullets with greatness and love ... It is not going to work, is it?

Nope. Its a wonderful idea that appeals to our best hippie instincts ... but it is just a worm on hook to suck people into their influence upon which the BKs are building their own transnational Empire by stealth.

Only time will tell.

As far as I know "soul consciousness" is taught in the Gita, in (Patanjali's) Raja Yoga and elsewhere, so it's "correct" to say the BKs don't own the expression or the reality ...

Despite guff like this, A Vision of Soul Consciousness.

Despite guff like this, A Vision of Soul Consciousness.

And "guff" it is ... even moreso from a woman who repeatedly claims she has never lied!!! Its mythomania (or pseudologia fantastica a compulsion to embroider the truth, engage in exaggeration, habitual or compulsive lying). Myth repeated until it become a truth in others minds ... as in the BKWSU *still* proclaiming that she was one of the founder leaders in 1937 ... when, in fact, her name is not even on the list of Om Mandli members.

We did a breakdown of this elsewhere. They say she was born in 1916 and joined the BKWSU when she was 21 (although the details is all questionable). Om Mandli actually started in 1932 when she would be 16 and between then and when she left her husband she had to get married and have a kid. So her memory of Lekhraj Kirpalani "before" would be memories of a young teenager child ... and what "encounters" would a female child REALLY have of gurus? Elsewhere it says she "had" many gurus ... more obviously her Father went to them for blessings and took the family with them.

[Lekhraj Kirpalani] never set himself up as a guru ... he would never accept service from us as most gurus would.

In the original materials we discover he was Prajapati God Brahma, the inventor of the Gita, and in the BK biographies we read of how followers (then senior BKs) hung necklaces of gold coins around his neck that they had gotten off the British for their property losses after Partition of India.

We saw that he was continually in communication with the Supreme

Until after 1950, there was no Supreme Soul ... Lekhraj Kirpalani was God and Krishna.

He never slept.

Elsewhere we read of how he and Om Radhe went off to their relatives to take a rest when it all got too much ... "Never slept"!?!

After I decided that I wanted to surrender to this calling, there was an amazing experience with Brahma Baba in which the inner eye opened up ... I could see that Brahma Baba had a direct link with God.

Not in the 1930s or 1940s she did ... God Shiva only appeared post-1950 sometime.

Although I had studied the Gita and the scriptures, I hadn't been able to understand them ... e was giving us a vision of soul consciousness and reminding us that we belong to Him.

Ditto ... how much understand is a child with 3 years of education going to have and what is so hard to understand in the Gita? Actually, Lekhraj Kirpalani's own advocate Hardy Hardayal comments on Lekhraj Kirpalani's understand and states that it was not great, "but fine for teaching the uneducated women".

Yes, here we have the nub of Dadi Janki Kripalani, her undying love for the powerful, handsome, benign and rich Lekhraj Kirpalani who was the only way out from her unhappy marriage and bad sexual experiences.

And on and on and on ... it should be a law that anyone who thinks they are One of the Top 8 souls in the world gets a psychotherapist.

As far as I know "soul consciousness" is taught in the Gita, in (Patanjali's) Raja Yoga and elsewhere, so it's "correct" to say the BKs don't own the expression or the reality ...

The problem with the BKWSU is that what we get is not just "soul consciousness," but soul consciousness™ with the BKWSU leaders at the helm of world domination.

Something taught in the Gita or something taught by BK's soul consciousness™, or by some other party etc, but where did the soul consciousness concept come from ?

Whatever the definition comes from, is it not correct, i.e. back to basics ... are you a soul ? If so, then consciousness of the soul is correct. If not, then are you not a soul (in BK speak, a body instead)?

For those who are ex-BKs or are leaving the BK, is this not the prime reason you have trouble leaving ... that you can no longer accept the BK definition of the soul, but yet you still cling to the fact that you are a soul except that you are not sure what it is other than the one defined by the BKs. Or have you accepted you are a soul from some other definition or practise ?

You could say has the BKs taken your soul away, but then how are you using that concept of soul if you no longer a BK ? Are you making up your own definition of "soul" as you go ?

Or as some other new poster recently phrased, "I am not a soul, I am a body", but this also has no depth since on what basis or whose definition are the words "soul" and "body" being used in this phrase.

One for Terry to answer ... he promised us an alternative explanation and that there is no soul.

There is nothing I can add except to say that the final answer is bound more complex that it is presented in the BKWSU, e.g. a consciousness with a spirit body around it. Personally, I think the self does exist as separate and that dissolution back into the Brahmand is misunderstood. But ... having said that ... it is probably a lot healthier just to be here in the now as you are in a body and face reality.

It is a natural understanding that all of us have, it's not a big deal ... we are living beings, we have natural awareness and understanding, it is universal and normal.

Philosopher Dan Dennett makes a compelling argument that not only don't we understand our own consciousness, but that half the time our brains are actively fooling us.

Dan Dennett: Can we know our own minds?

And what about people with only half a brain, are they being fooled 4 times as often?

Who on this forum, or what proportion of BKs, experience being "out of the bodies" or everyday bodily state of awareness?

The Murlis and PBKs put some of these experiences down as being "visions" or boons on the basis of past religious efforts. How no one knows. I suspect some are actually created under psychic influence from disincarnate spirit entities and mistaken for "soul consciousness". Some though, I suspect, are real and universal with non-BK and other yogi experience. Who can tell the difference? No one has invented a "soul-consciousness-ometer"

... or should that just be an "Om-meter" fullstop?

Who here has experienced "soul consciousness" and what was it? Who can say that BK adherents genuinely feel differently from non-BKs and that BKism is not just a social commitment and a relatively fruitless intellectual pursuit?

The joke in that question is ... and let me lack humility to say what a good one the idea of an Om-meter is ... soul-consciousness is meant to be the 'be all and end all' of Brahma-Kumarism, but I suspect there is not a single answer or consensus about what it is. BK teachers just ask such questions, and listen to all sorts of answers in a motherly fashion, as a yukti to keep their followers occupied.

My current feeling is that there are different level of "being" but that mostly "soul-consciousness" just passes as a psychological device of control ... a mystical golden pot at the end of a rainbow, a mystical holy grail to keep adherents seeking and making efforts for whilst they donate money.

Can anyone report senior BK's discussion about how they felt in relationship to their body beyond such extra-ordinary experiences? I cannot imagine dozing at Amrit Vela they feel any different from any other human being.

That's because they simply are the same as all human beings, but as they have developed a faith, they feel superior.

All religions will try and tell you they have exclusivity, but of course none and no-one has ... the truth is everyone is equally spiritual.