Godly Claims

Does anyone know how many of todays Gurus, spiritual leaders/organisations are actually claiming to have the direct word of God coming to them in this actual time period, direct as opposed to reading from the scriptures or inspiration, is it just the BKs/PBKs?

Does anyone know how many of todays Gurus, spiritual leaders/organisations are actually claiming to have the direct word of God coming to them in this actual time period, direct as opposed to reading from the scriptures or inspiration, is it just the BKs/PBKs?

Excluding Christians who say it is Jesus [ because they have no conception God speaks to them directly ] ?

Exculding Christians who say it is Jesus?

Really, are there Christians saying Jesus is speaking through them?

Really, are there Christians saying Jesus is speaking through them?

http://www.wordsfromjesus.com/
http://www.wordsfromjesus.com/Jennifer.html

Funny thing is, all thse spooks kind of sound the same to me. I do not mean that dismissively, most of what they say is good stuff. I write " spooks " because, to my mind, that is the only sure thing we can call them.

There is no Imperial Spookometer to test the divinity of these channelled spirits and identifying them. One can only have faith. Faith in the 'spooks', that they are who they say they are, on the basis of the 'proofs' they provide in their messages and actions. To me, it seems like the tone of their messages are quite similar. And there has been a history of them going back many years. Certainly right back through the 20th Century.

The questions I might consider are ; is this the same spirit of group of spirits that Shiv belongs to? Is this Shiv talking to others in another voice? Are these the same spirits that have been talking to humanity through out all time guiding them? Are they human souls that have risen or another level of being altogether? Are they misleading [ the fallen Angels of Light speaking scripture to deceive? Do they need us to provide their energy through our Yoga? Are we just their prey somewhere lower down in the psychic food chain?

Joel flagged up the Pathwork Lectures earlier ; http://www.awakentruth.org/lectures.html

No claims of divinity there but interesting stuff.

Benjamin Creme is another ; http://www.shareintl.org/

He talks about 'overshadowing' is a similar manner to the PBKs suggesting BB or Lekhraj Kirpalani or BapDada can. I will try and name a few others. I think it helps to identify that what is going on in BK circles in not entirely unique and to suggest a widespread phenomona that requires investigation.

Dear John,

Very interesting question. I think there are Christians who would say that God speaks to them and and perhaps through them in the loose sense but I don't think directly in the first person as the case of BK / PBK chariots. It doesn't really fit in with Christian theology, it's not something that God does. There are some Christian channellers of Jesus and of Mary the mother of God (not sure about God as such) on the fringes but they wouldn't be accepted by mainstream Christians. The one mentioned by ex-l above I think writes down a message she hears in her head rather being the voice of Jesus in real time.

On the more eastern side of things there are various avatars known to the West who claim to be God and so in a sense when they speak it is God speaking but again this is a different theology to BK / PBK and not as dramatic a claim. Arjun mentioned on the XBKC forum that there have been various further offshoot chariots from BK which may or may not have survived. But whether there is anything similar in India unrelated to BK is difficult to know. Of course the fact that we in the West haven't heard about it doesn't mean that it doesn't exist - it could just be that it is not an international organisation. It's hard to tell from here what goes on in India - I would love to know more about this.

Then of course there is a lot of channelling in the New Age scene but really this seems like a lot of nonsense to me so I don't know much about it.

Benjamin Creme is another ; http://www.shareintl.org/

He talks about 'overshadowing' is a similar manner to the PBKs suggesting BB or Lekhraj Kirpalani or BapDada can.

Mr Creme channels various 'ascended masters' such as Maitreya, but not God.

Arjun mentioned on the XBKC forum that there have been various further offshoot chariots from BK which may or may not have survived.

Yes, I remember the mention of these as the Vishnu Party or incarnation of Shiva into a Chariot as Vishnu. I am sure Arjun knows a lot more about it.

As you say it can be very hard to know what is going on whilst living in the West. In a city like Delhi there seems to be massive posters on every street corner advertising a guru or Yoga group. It could even be a statistical thing, you could start up a new 'path' and statistically find it has followers because there are so many seekers or devotees.

Interesting links ex-l, it's a bigger phenomenoum than I realised, would be very interesting to find a group who where making actual claims as per BK/PBK ... the God in person thingy.

Hi

they seek him here, they seek him there ... he's a dedicated follower of fashion. Another of "God's" incarnations ; http://www.fom.com/index.html The Ancient Path of Supreme Truth, God Realization, Freedom and Happiness.

I have no idea who this lot are but they reckon it is the God himself. Nice mental hooks ;

they pre-empt the vast majority of the world as not being interested - thereby setting those that are up to be special and chosen.

then they require a year or more of study before you are 'ready' just like going to Madhuban - by which one time has made such a commitment so as to be less likely to dismiss whatever it is you find in there.

However, the Supreme Intelligence and Heart of God, Knows the heart of a seeker who encounters Him. God will not Give that understanding and insight to a superficial, half-hearted, and casual spiritual-hobbyist, even though such a person may sit in a Meeting room with God Incarnate for a decade, Surrounded and Impacted by My Presence and Force which goes beyond this Body to infinity

In India I reckon they have as many 'Gods' and we do Tescos*. Including smaller local 'convenience' branches of God that you can pop down to late at night when you are running out of stuff; and great big 'HyperGods' [like SaiBaba] with massive carparks and queues at all the tills for stocking up for weeks.

Now do not let me put your religion down folks, it is just that I am all Godded out for a long time. Stocked up to the eyeballs with philosophies that are past their sell by date.

[ * for non-Brits replace Tesco with Wallmart, Lidl, Carrefour etc. ]

Another channel for God. This one looks like a small independent corner shop ;

Maitreya is a divine messenger. His sense of independent functioning has been replaced with divine animation so that he can be used as a clear channel for messages from God. Source is the author of every word Maitreya writes. These transmissions herald the time of great change, the transition from darkness to light. This book contains many new ideas for you.

http://www.ishwara.com/story.htm

Omshanti.
I have already mentioned that there are many groups within the BK establishment who claim to be either the chariots of Shiv or to have direct connection with Him. There have been quite a few groups that have emerged from the Advance Party (PBKs) also who either themselves or through their followers claim to be the medium of Shiv. Many of these groups along with their locations have been mentioned by ShivBaba in the clarification Murlis (VCD* and Discussion CDs) being narrated to the PBKs.

But they have very little following and most of even those who follow them visit the BK centers also simultaneously, because BKs are primarily opposed to the PBKs and not to other groups. So I have seen many cases of ex-PBKs (i.e. members of the off shoots) who visit the BKs as well as their new guru (or Baba).

With regards,
OGS,
Arjun.

So I have seen many cases of ex-PBKs (i.e. members of the off shoots) who visit the BKs as well as their new guru (or Baba).

Do you know of any that would be willing to join this forum to share their experiences and voice their reasons/opinions. Whatever they are, they are (or were) still part of the Brahmin family Yagya are they not?

So I have seen many cases of ex-PBKs (i.e. members of the off shoots) who visit the BKs as well as their new guru (or Baba).

Do you know of any that would be willing to join this forum to share their experiences and voice their reasons/opinions.
Whatever they are, they are (or were) still part of the Brahmin family Yagya are they not?

This is really a question for the PBK forum but what would interest me to ask is does ShivBaba [Shiva through Virendra Dev Dixit] still make such a clear distinction between the BKs/PBKs and the rest of the world/Shudras. The old Sakar Murlis were full of it. "You are pure, they are impure ... You are Godly Family, they are Shudras, " etc. Does 'ShivBaba' still go in this divisive manner, e.g. " You are PBKs, they are BKs, ex-PBKs are lower than the lowest of the low ... " etc.? Or is he/they over that? What is suggested by many's experience is that just because someone dons a white sari, it does not make them divine. Perhaps quite the opposite.

It would impress me so much more if these souls just turned around and said, " look, I don't know who I am, names are not important, but being without a body I can see a little bit ahead of you. I am here to try and help anyone. Try this and see if it works ... ". Instead of making it into an exclusive club and clan warfare. I appreciate that He/They have come to primarily sort India out and India both needs it most and is most ripe for such guidance. Given that, He/They are stuck with having to use and work with the tools, structures and symbols within the India society and psyche to speak to human beings. In truth, by comparison to the rest of Indian values and faiths [ e.g. caste system, abuse of women, crazy religions, pandemic corruption and inequality ], I think that what they are offering is worth the sacrifices and has the potent to be a better alternative.

Naturally, the human interpreters that have to take some blame for the manner in which they implement what they have been told. It would be worth putting aside all the factionalism, as Bansy writes [ BK versus PBK versus ex-BK ], and just to get on with rolling out the alternative lifestyle/s. We are all closer together than we are apart.

Its funny that the BKWSU can advertise its greatness by bringing together divergent saddhus, sanyasis and other religions but it reacts neurotically and goes into denial when faced with its / 'Shiva's' own divergent religions.

• Perhaps we should organise a conference and invite them both / us all to meet. See if the BKs would share their Guddi with us?

• What are the chances of getting ShivBaba [Shiva through Virendra Dev Dixit] to meet with BapDada [Shiva and Brahma through Dadi Gulzar] in order to sort their difference out and demostrate who is who?

• Has BapDada ever been asked outright what He/They think of ShivBaba?

One of the weirder ones ...David Shayler is God

Apparently He (God via David Shayler) went to a psychic that apparently channels the spirit of Mary Magdalen who anointed him as Jesus. Allegedly, he was also some anicent revolutionary, John the Divine, King Arthur, Leonardo di Vinci AND the Archangel Metatron. Dressed all in white the spirit that came to him told him he was the Messiah and to go public with he realisation of Earth changes to come.

Apparently the first lesson in spirituality is that we must judge others and so he is here to test us but seeing if we think he is nuts ... the Universe being set up to reward Yesu and those who help him and punish those that obstruct him.

Does this sound familiar to anyone? Are their a whole load of spooks going about whispering the same message in folk's ear?

As an MI5 whistleblower and fugitive, former spy David Shayler's powers as an agent of the state were revoked. But now he claims to have more powers than anyone on Earth could possibly imagine. For, after a period of reflection following his jailing for breaching the Official Secrets Act, Mr Shayler has concluded that he is the Messiah. Last night, proclaiming himself 'God', he explained: "What I'd say to people is: Do I look mentally ill? Do I sound mentally ill? The reason I am putting out this message is because I am absolutely convinced - as convinced as I can be of anything in this world - that the universe is changing shape and humanity has to prepare for that, and that I am here to help teach people."

Mr Shayler spent years on the run after exposing alleged wrongdoing at the heart of the Secret Service, including a claim that MI6 was involved in a failed assassination attempt on Libyan leader Colonel Gaddafi. Eventually he returned to Britain voluntarily and was sentenced to six months in jail in 2002. Since then, he has made ends meet giving speeches to conspiracy theorists. Last night, in an interview with More4 News, Mr Shayler made the astonishing claim that he had seen a psychic who he believes channelled the spirit of Mary Magdalene and anointed him as the Messiah. He told the programme: "Suddenly my whole life made sense. I felt a sense of peace, I suddenly realised why it had been how it had - why I seem to get such a strange deal from the universe, when I seem to be trying to tell the truth about everything."

Glastonbury Symposium - Sunday July 29th - 9.30pm

Let it be recorded that the time & date shown above is almost the exact moment Davis Shayler announced, to a stunned but largely sympathetic audience, that he is the new Messiah.

High on another stunning presentation from Ian Crane, the atmosphere in a packed Glastonbury Town Hall was pregnant with expectation as David Shayler was wired for sound. Already prepared for controversy by host Andy Thomas, nobody could have anticipated what was about to occur. An extremely tolerant and generally sympathetic audience sat in stunned silence as they endured an hour long narcissistic monologue during which a frail-looking David Shayler explained that he was not only the re-incarnation of the Christ but also the re-incarnation of King Arthur, Leonardo Da Vinci and a whole host of other historically significant characters. As the monologue progressed, it would have been obvious to any student of Stanislav Grof that Mr Shayler is in the middle of his very own 'Spiritual Emergency'! When David Shayler concluded his self-obsessed rant by standing centre stage with arms outstretched in mock crucifixion, the raptuous ovation which had followed Ian Crane's presentation was replaced by polite but nervous applause.

Surely David has friends or family who are capable of pointing out that he is not even the new David Icke, let alone the New Messiah! Listening in on numerous conversations in the pub after the event, the general reaction was one of sympathetic concern. It is very sad to see a man who has commanded tremendous respect for blowing the whistle on the British Intelligence Services for attempting to assassinate Col Gaddafi, descend into such blatant paranoid psychosis. If his claims of the numerous attempts on his life have any substance, it doesn't say much for the capabilities of Black Op's teams that he is still on this mortal coil ... but then David claims that he has 'raised his spiritual vibration' to such a level that he is invincible. I hope with all sincerity that this claim is not put to the test.

We will need to rent an even wider stage now if we are to present all the chariots together.

Mr Shayler has concluded that he is the Messiah. Last night, proclaiming himself 'God', he explained: "What I'd say to people is: Do I look mentally ill? Do I sound mentally ill? The reason I am putting out this message is because I am absolutely convinced - as convinced as I can be of anything in this world - that the universe is changing shape and humanity has to prepare for that, and that I am here to help teach people."

Thanks ex-l.

The old Sakar Murlis were full of it. "You are pure, they are impure ... You are Godly Family, they are Shudras,

I think all the fight is only due some misundertsanding. I don't remember having heard in the Murli like this or at least don't have such feeling left. No one has promoted that we are pure and they are impure. On the contrary it is said in the Murli that you cannot call yourself pure or perfect yet, the whole world is impure, there is no one who is pure.

About the many gods, they are also limited. They are becoming more and more and smaller and smaller in their influence. It is the degraded stage we pass so it has to happen