(back on topic)
As a teenager I was an atheist, and scientific rationalist. This was my response, from an early age, to the feeble attempts of my churchy parents and The Church of Scotland to teach me their path.
But once I hit my 20s - nigh on 20 years before encountering the BKWSU - I became more and more aware of receiving subtle guidance, and assistance in times of crisis. I was soon believing absolutely in God on the basis of these experiences. For a long while I thought it was God that was guiding, supporting, and talking to me, and I never thought deeply about it or studied theology or whatever - it was experiential, with accumulating evidence that I could only explain in terms of "God", although my concept of God remained very vague. I rejected all religion on principle, except that I did become interested in Buddhism for a while, but rejected it as it seemed to deny God.
Then, aged 27, I started on a journey of earnest spiritual seeking, and soon started receiving a lot of visionary experiences, some of which I have already described in earlier posts on this forum. I met Brahma Baba / BapDada in the white light Subtle Regions, and Shiv Baba in Paramdham. I had no idea who these beings were, only that they were very familiar, and the experiences were sublime and astonishing. I then understood that it was Brahma Baba who had been guiding and assisting me for all those years, and that he was NOT God, but like a friendly elder Brother in ghost form, who was teaching me many things, and looking out for me, as I stumbled around in my ignorance doing stupid things. Shiv Baba came across as a very special soul, different from the others - lighter and more playful - but I certainly did not perceive him (it) as God either. (I had no names for Brahma and Shiva then - until 12 years later the BKs supplied their names).
I remained God centered, understanding God as the universal omnipresent God that the Murlis keep ridiculing. I had a conscious waking outdoor experience of that omnipresence, that was very real and lasted for maybe 20 minutes - I became one with all of creation, with the corn in the fields, the trees, plants insects, birds, animals, humans: a stunning and beautiful experience of one-ness.
Nothing in BK life or teachings describes or explains that experience.
I still have that concept of God, but when I was with the BKs I switched to accepting Shiv Baba as God, as, quite simply, it worked, spectacularly, in terms of deep Yoga, and self transformation (destroying sanskars that were a burden).
Since then I returned to my previous omnipresent non-personal conception of God. However, I have recently decided again to accept "Shiv Baba" as "God" because I have direct experience of him (it) and that experience continues on a daily basis (nothing to do with the BKWSU), while the impersonal universal God is just a concept or feeling, not a living being. Now I accept both concepts of God, a Zen approach that I no longer try to intellectualise, or worry about.
I have concluded that it is useless to intellectualise around God. You have to go by your own experiences. And mine produces two incompatible results! Which one is God? Is either one God? It doesn't matter!
However, one thing is clear to me: do not accept the teachings or opinions of others on the basis of faith or indoctrination. Find your own answers that work for you.
As a teenager I was an atheist, and scientific rationalist. This was my response, from an early age, to the feeble attempts of my churchy parents and The Church of Scotland to teach me their path.
But once I hit my 20s - nigh on 20 years before encountering the BKWSU - I became more and more aware of receiving subtle guidance, and assistance in times of crisis. I was soon believing absolutely in God on the basis of these experiences. For a long while I thought it was God that was guiding, supporting, and talking to me, and I never thought deeply about it or studied theology or whatever - it was experiential, with accumulating evidence that I could only explain in terms of "God", although my concept of God remained very vague. I rejected all religion on principle, except that I did become interested in Buddhism for a while, but rejected it as it seemed to deny God.
Then, aged 27, I started on a journey of earnest spiritual seeking, and soon started receiving a lot of visionary experiences, some of which I have already described in earlier posts on this forum. I met Brahma Baba / BapDada in the white light Subtle Regions, and Shiv Baba in Paramdham. I had no idea who these beings were, only that they were very familiar, and the experiences were sublime and astonishing. I then understood that it was Brahma Baba who had been guiding and assisting me for all those years, and that he was NOT God, but like a friendly elder Brother in ghost form, who was teaching me many things, and looking out for me, as I stumbled around in my ignorance doing stupid things. Shiv Baba came across as a very special soul, different from the others - lighter and more playful - but I certainly did not perceive him (it) as God either. (I had no names for Brahma and Shiva then - until 12 years later the BKs supplied their names).
I remained God centered, understanding God as the universal omnipresent God that the Murlis keep ridiculing. I had a conscious waking outdoor experience of that omnipresence, that was very real and lasted for maybe 20 minutes - I became one with all of creation, with the corn in the fields, the trees, plants insects, birds, animals, humans: a stunning and beautiful experience of one-ness.
Nothing in BK life or teachings describes or explains that experience.
I still have that concept of God, but when I was with the BKs I switched to accepting Shiv Baba as God, as, quite simply, it worked, spectacularly, in terms of deep Yoga, and self transformation (destroying sanskars that were a burden).
Since then I returned to my previous omnipresent non-personal conception of God. However, I have recently decided again to accept "Shiv Baba" as "God" because I have direct experience of him (it) and that experience continues on a daily basis (nothing to do with the BKWSU), while the impersonal universal God is just a concept or feeling, not a living being. Now I accept both concepts of God, a Zen approach that I no longer try to intellectualise, or worry about.
I have concluded that it is useless to intellectualise around God. You have to go by your own experiences. And mine produces two incompatible results! Which one is God? Is either one God? It doesn't matter!
However, one thing is clear to me: do not accept the teachings or opinions of others on the basis of faith or indoctrination. Find your own answers that work for you.