The Tree (World Religions)

It is also said in the Murlis that the Trimurti picture is not accurate. So why not change the picture? These pictures are just for explaining, they are a tool, they are not the source of knowledge. It is said in the Murli that we don't even need them.

Om Shanti. Fully agree with you, it should be done.

Shankar

Om Shanti. Fully agree with you, it should be done.

But how? Who are the actual souls playing the roles of Brahma, Vishnu and Shankar at present?

But how? Who are the actual souls playing the roles of Brahma, Vishnu and Shankar at present?

Om Shanti. Brahma is Brahma Baba (Lekhraj Kirpalani), Vishnu is combined form of Dadi Gulzar's body + Brahma Baba's angelic body (fine body) + Lord Shiva (Supreme Soul). But what about Shankar? I sign as Shankar. But also PBKs have their own Shankar. So who is who we'll find out after our personal meeting.

Shankar

Dear Brother BKDimok,

Please, see an answer in the PBK section - topic "Trimurti Shiva?"

There are also used for propaganda, social and mental conditioning.

Is there anything wrong with religious propaganda? I know here to be religious means to be strange. There is this firm image of the cold sceptic, the intellectual, that everyone becomes. However it seems that these religious persons who have to hide their religiousness, to avoid mockings, are fine people.

They have some bright ideas, and although it can be childish, they have some faith in something, some hope, some insight. They also seem to be more happy in their daily life and manage in the familly and problems well with some core principles. The other way is to over-intellectualize and make every matter complicated. One will just say love and other one will know this is "sublimation of energy due to some infant trauma that projects itself in an adorable image that will substitude the simbol of the archetype of the need of security and self assurance ... etc"

Now do you think BKs gather with the intention to dominate the society and human being's minds. Who creates or sustains this image of the powerful hidden society. There is nothing like this. There are ordinary people there. If you slap them on the face they will feel the same way as anyone. In their facing society they will feel as strang? as anyone else.

In the Murli it is said that Baba likes big pictures. Indeed there is something in this. As if one does not hide anything and these are clear. BKs also enter the society with the attitude to wake it up, enlighten it and help people, but they are genuine. Most of them just lack some insight so they do what they are said to, there is something in this as well.

Now what is wrong in these pictures, whether they are correct or not, if it is just a possible theory, then there is no harm in presenting it. The history we learn at school, it is only a theory too, but because all cannot be scientist, historian etc., then the ordinary one does not dare confront it, because it needs a lot of study, but just accepts the authority. Now because this knowledge is very simple then everyone learns it for few days and feels free to confront it or makes it up.

We know to the extent everyone knows, then why some feel OK with The Knowledge and some not? Is it only to say some are stupid and some clever. Maybe it is some tendency or habit like from the past, whatever we have followed it is easy to adopt. Authority, logic, history, and emotions through these ideas are proved.

One is to learn and one is to look from an angle. Why would we accept that Charles Darwin or Sigmund Freud were not only glory obsessed, egoistic, meterial gain oriented or having some personal problems and their study is only a result of these, because we did not know them personally. At least in The Knowledge there is some holiness and in the people. There may be many complaints about people, but are there any complaints towards The Knowledge.

Is there any wrong practice that is preached or wrong ideas, i mean no matter whether they are right or wrong, are they righteous. There are righteous ideas and practices and result is good. This knowledge is not to create unhappy or dependant people. If praticed properly it should lead us to heaven.

First time I am coming to this topic. I just read the whole thread.

Congratulations andrey for your courage! I agree with most what you said.

I never thought The Tree was meant to be historically accurate, nor did I ever think that the Bible or any other religious scripture was. On the other hand I do not think that history can ever be accurate either. It can only be approximate, which does not mean it is irrelevant, by far.

For me The Tree is not an object of scientific debate. It is a teaching tool and, although simplistic and approximate, I don't think it is irrelevant either. It is a snapshot of the BK teachings and it can be useful to explain some basic concepts relating to the journey of the soul, more specifically the Brahmin or deity soul. Within that context I see no problem with the inaccuracies of The Tree.

In terms of numbers, I have done the mathematics long time ago.

If we accept that there are 900,000 at the beginning of the Golden Age and that some 75 years later each of the 450,000 couples have two children, it brings us to 1.8 million. Those children will form another 450,000 couples and another 75 years later they would have had two children each, which adds another 900,000 and brings the total to 2.7 million. At that point however, the 900,000 grand parents are just about to die. Thus, before the youngest ones get their own 2 kids, we are back to 1.8 million. Do you see the point? From then on, the population of the Golden Age should never exceed 2.7 millions.

It is said that during Silver Age the reproduction rate has some twitches and some couples do get more than 2 children. We should then assume some gradual increase in population from then on.

I have always understood that the general understanding was that there are 900,000 at the beginning of Golden Age, 20 millions at the beginning of Silver Age, 330 millions at the end of Silver Age and 5.5 to 6 billions at the end of Iron Age. This means that the population would increase 22 times over during Golden Age (when couples have only 2 kids), 15 times over during Silver Age (when they may have a third one) and only 18 times over during the whole second half of the Kalpa (when there is no limits on the number of kids one may have)!

Even without considering historical evidences, I think we can not take God literally on numbers.

Hey! Murli team! Somethinig needs revision here.

At that point however, the 900,000 grand parents are just about to die. Thus, before the youngest ones get their own 2 kids, we are back to 1.8 million. Do you see the point? From then on, the population of the Golden Age should never exceed 2.7 millions.

Even without considering historical evidences, I think we can not take God literally on numbers.

Thank you Ti-Pit for your reasonableness. This is what I have been hinting at for a long time, trying to point out not just the anomalies but our willingness to accept them unquestioning. And my feeling is that we can take this further. Indeed, if we take it literally in its entirety, ever 75 years there is going to be a terrible demands on maternity ward resources ...

It does not work out ... and yet we still teach it and accept the teacher of it. It would only work out if souls were able to pop out of the Soul World and manifest a body out of nothing ... and, of course, that is not taught. Thankfully. And I am pretty sure that if we continue to do the mathematics, it will continue to not work out throught the Silver and Copper Ages. I am so sure, and so sure it will fall on deaf ears, that I cant even be bothered to sit down and work it out !

Hey! Murli team! Somethinig needs revision here.

Hush ... do not give them any more ideas or encouragement!!!

Now folks, can you see what is actually done when a soul is described as having left Baba? All these inconsistencies get completely ignored! The Knowledge remains sacrosanct.

BKTi-Pit, i am afraid that as BKs our intellects have become impervious to your maths. Thanks for a great post.

Could be that descriptions are related to the Confluence Age, like Radha and Krishna being of two separate kingdoms (because there are no two kingdoms in the Golden Age, and there is only one kingdom), similarly the marriage - there is no marriage in Golden Age, birth, death, years could represent some spiritual birth, death, age.

It is also possible the rough idea we have for the Golden Age from the Murlis - age, birth, dearth etc. is description of the life of only one couple or the most some very few who has come most close to this aim. Then it could be that more than two children are born in Golden Age too.

Also the years could be not so punctual. Also the numbers, they may be punctual, but how do you think, now, 899 999 souls are there and there is nothing happening, Golden Age is put on hold, then the number 900 000 soul comes up and Golden Age starts moving. It is like the idea of destruction. It happens more slowly and naturally.

If we keep in mind physical golden bricks and fancy clothes as pictured, then it is hard to believe, but if we believe in it naturally that it will indeed become and put ourselves there, look around and see the world and see how it moves, we can have some finer idea.

Also nature if we take that it will need some years for renovation, then will she be working for these years and on the day the last year ends it will suddenly stop. We see now how nature slowly changes in such a way that we even can adapt a little. So first we adopt heaven with the mind, the soul and this is also slowly. Yes, there is one second, but there are a lot of efforts.

It is also a study, we are ignorant and unexperienced in exactly this way of study. We cannot have experience from anywhere else, because it is unique study. The same way when we are novice in some area, with no knowledge and experience and we try for something and give up, because it does not work, but the master comes and says "You should just lift that lever, this is how it works" We can also try hard and find out for ourselves.

I mean that those who were not content, because they needed explanations could become content, because explanation could be there.

It is also like a travel. Parents could have been to the place or not but children keep on asking "when will we be arriving." Soon. Saying soon, many years have passed, but the journey goes on, we have not arrived or stopped. We could have stopped for a break or arrive to some places, but we have not yet reached the final destination. Then the duty of the parents is just this to comfort the children during the journey. We also are responsible for ourselves to make our journey pleasant or be nervous.

Could be that ...

andrey, trust me, anything you said after the three words that i retained from your post is oblox. WE can only follow a phrase like "could be that", with a construct.

Now i will read the rest of the post. Thanks for posting.

I don't know what is "oblox", and don't understand what is the meaning of "construct".

I don't know what is "oblox", and don't understand what is the meaning of "construct".

andrey, if none of that can be proven then we choose to believe it as a matter of personal preference and not because it is verifiable. andrey, when i hear "Could it be that" i see my mind being invited to go on journey of speculation. What purpose does this serve?

andrey, i have been wondering whether all we BK types simply love having stories read to us, like all good children everywhere. Tucked up nicely in the Murli room, soothed by the music and Yoga. We then snuggle up to Baba to the sound of the Murli and get well and truly programmed. Sweet dreams for all.

yeah, yeah, yeah stories at bedtime IS a memorial of the Confluence Age, is not it?

andrey, please do not feel offended by this post. i am really trying to understand this situation because i too can do the same thing that you did after the first four words of your post. It is actually quite frightening if you detach and really think about it.

OK, i understood.

OK I understood

Thank you andrey

My friend andrey, i seek permission to mangle your post in an attempt to explore for myself how i claim to spot oblox.

Could be that blah blah blah because there are blah blah blah It is also possible blah blah Then it could be blah blah blah Also the years blah blah blah It is like the idea of blah blah blah It happens more slowly and naturally. Does it?

If we keep in mind physical golden bricks and fancy clothes as pictured, then it is hard to believe, but if we believe in it naturally that it will indeed become and put ourselves there, look around and see the world and see how it moves, we can have some finer idea. Oh yeah?

Also nature if we take blah blah blah It is also a study, blah blah blah excuses ... The same way when we are novice blah blah baby talk blah with no knowledge and experience and we try for something and give up, because it does not work, but the master comes and says "You should just lift that lever, this is how it works" We can also try hard and find out for ourselves. blah blah blah make efforts for the reward is great.

Get my drift andrey?
Thanks